Asperger’s, Bullying, and Unsolicited Advice, Just Ask Mom Podcast Series, episode 9

In this episode, a mother shares her experience of the recent diagnosis of her son with Asperger’s Syndrome. She discusses the journey to the diagnosis and how well-meaning, but often misguided advice from family and friends can make this already difficult journey all the more painful. She discusses her son’s experiences being bullied in school and the pain of watching your child grow up without friends.

Transcription

Voice: Welcome to the Just Ask Mom podcast where mothers share their experiences of raising children with mental illness.  Just Ask Mom is a Mothers on the Frontline production. Today we will speak with a mother whose son was recently diagnosed with Aspergers.

Tammy: Tell us something about yourself.

Mother: That makes it really tough.

Tammy: I know.

Mother: Right? You think it’s all easy and then you are like…. I’m a middle age woman that is a mother of a single child. We’re on the path for a diagnosis of Asperger’s. This was a recent diagnosis, or process of a diagnosis, for us. It was a bit of a shocker. Prior to having my son, I nannied for 17 years, so I was around kids, help raise kids, manage kids. My son came along. Everything seemed fine, until now, when we really started to notice some differences and the fact that he is very routine-oriented. And just some of the changes that we’ve seen compared to the other kids. But this is tough.

Tammy: It’s tough.

Mother: Man.

Tammy: It is.

Mother: My favorite thing to do – technology. It is always something with a cell phone or the computer – a gadget of some sort. So, that is what I spend a lot of time doing, that and taking pictures.

Tammy: So that’s what you enjoy doing.

Mother: My son lives in front of the camera. Poor kid. I love him to death but.. he’s like, “Hey, you got that on my face again?”.

Tammy: It’s nice to share a passion, right?

Mother: It is.

Tammy: So that part is really good. So, you are going through this with your son. I want to know what you would like other family members to know. Who you know, because we have a lot of people out there who are going through this and they probably feel the same way. What, you are the one in the middle of it, what do you want family members who they mean very well but don’t- aren’t in the middle of it. What do you want them to know? What would you want to say to them?

Mother: So, let’s go back probably about seven months ago, when we hit a rough spot with our son, who had a day where he was so overwhelmed that he couldn’t function at all. And at that point I knew we needed to do something. We needed to figure out what was causing all the behavior and triggering this because he literally was just a body. His eyes were glassed over. He just would sit and cry. He couldn’t get dressed. The thought of going to school made him physically sick. This is a kid who up until this point loved school.

Tammy: Really?

Mother: That’s when I intervened and said, “Okay, you know, we got to do something”. After talking with family members– they were giving great suggestions, you know, trying to help —but we knew we weren’t on the right path. So we intervened with a therapist who has worked really hard with our son. With a suggestion of a friend I looked at what we felt potentially was Asperger’s and looking at our son knew that he had a lot of the same characteristics. A lot of the same things – looking back of course as a parent you feel really guilty. Because you didn’t see these things sooner but getting that groundwork work with that therapist helped me immensely sit down with my parents, with my in-laws, with my husband, with my siblings, and talk to them about what we’ve seen, what we see going forward, how we are going to try to approach things for him. Because it’s not easy. It’s very stressful. His stress is also my stress. And when he is worked up, then I can’t relax and it just throws the whole family dynamic off. Of course we got the “it’s because he is an only child? It’s because you are too hard on him. maybe if you did more with him. If you took him out and have him do more things he would be more social. That’s part of it. You are not exposing him to enough, you know? Are you sure that he’s on schedule that tight? Have you, you know, really sat back and watched?” Most definitely. The kid gets up in the morning. He has his specific clothes in mind before he gets out of bed. We lay there and talk for five minutes. He gets up. He gets dressed in a specific order. I have tried to change that up. It turns the world upside down. I’m just thinking, “Ok, so much as putting your socks on before your pants can’t be done”. But if in your mind that’s what you need, I’m fine with that. I’m okay. But until I tested that a couple of times, did I find out, right? I just thought, “Oh, it’s just him being particular about one thing”. But we have a certain routine with getting dressed. A certain way to put deodorant on. A certain way to put cologne on. We have to hit the bathroom at a certain time. We don’t do our hair, we make our hair.

Tammy: Really?

Mother: Yes, he makes his hair every morning. So, whatever style he has in his head, he makes it.

Tammy: I see.

Mother: I don’t understand where that comes from, but that’s ok. It’s not worth an argument over come at the end of the day. He eats the same food for breakfast every day until he is tired of it. He eats the same for lunch every day until he is tired of it. So, it’s very, very specific. We have to live this with him every day.

Tammy: Does he get very anxious if anything goes off his schedule?

Mother: Yes. It causes major issues. And he’ll start to fidget. Mostly he’ll either pick at his fingers or hands to try to calm himself. Compression shirts have made a huge difference for him.

Tammy: Wonderful.

Mother: Convincing him to wear them on the other hand was not easy. It took a lot of work but we’re there. It’s a safety blanket now so we don’t leave home without them.

Tammy:

Mother: I’ve invested in. I don’t know how many shirts we have in every color because for him his shirt has to match his pants. And his shirt and his socks have to match or we have an awful day. You cannot use black or blue as universal color. It is specific. It has too match. So it’s very, very tough. I never thought about this. We can do a whole series on shopping with an autistic child – it has to be a certain fabric, a certain color…

Mother: They have to fit a certain way.

Tammy: If you do it then that it’s going to help the child be well throughout the day.

Mother: Yes. It makes a huge difference. And for someone who doesn’t see this, for someone that’s not behind those closed doors on a daily basis, they can throw all kinds of great ideas out there to help you, but until they are in your shoes, they are not going to get the full picture. I would like to have more family members there to see how our days go. To give them more insight because until your hands on, you don’t get it. You see him as this spoiled child who’s throwing that temper tantrum because something, you know, to us seems so small that didn’t go right. But to them it’s significant. It’s hard for them to process it. And the lengthy talks that we have incorporated into everything that doesn’t go right to turn it into a lesson, and explain why things are going the way they are and try to help, navigate through so that they get it. It’s not easy finding the correct language to use so that you don’t frustrate them that much more. It causes a lot of stress on mom.

Tammy: Absolutely. Absolutely.

Mother: Because it’s a lot of trial and error, and with family you get stuck in the middle of that because you’re trying to do what’s best for your child. But yet, you are trying to get them to understand and you don’t want to offend anyone by not doing what they have suggested. But if you go back at them with any sort of evidence then they are upset. Even though they’re meaning well and trying to help, they are mad because you didn’t try it. And it’s just- you feel like you’re stuck in the middle of a cyclone. Because everything around you it’s just spinning so fast.

Tammy: But everyone else gets to conveniently leave the cyclone except for you and your son, right?

Mother: For sure. You’re exactly right. And it’s so crazy because when it comes down to it the more schedule oriented we are, the most smoothly things go, and the better days that he has. But if we are off task, it’s hard to get back on. I didn’t realize how hard that could be until I started reading and understanding what we are dealing with. And now it’s like a light bulb moment and to me it’s becoming second nature. When we took a trip over the weekend, to not come home is significant for him. He has his bed, a certain routine. We don’t mess with that very often. But when we do, we know it’s going to be bad. And so we talk about it for days. I have family that would say, “You’re treating him like a two-year old”. “You are talking about this way too much”. And I’ll say, “But we need to talk about it so that our trip goes better”. If I don’t, his behavior is going to be horrible. And I get the push back. “He’s 11, he knows better”. Theoretically, yes. But with what we are working on, it doesn’t click. It’s ok. We talk about it, we’ve got it all figured out. Just don’t mess with his routine and it will be ok. Once we get there, it’s fine. And he’ll have fun. But we have to work through that on a daily basis. We talk about his school schedule on the way to school every day because he has a couple of classes that change. It’s ok. If we don’t, he gets confused.

Tammy: So it’s very important for him to know what to expect. But if that’s expectation is disrupted, it’s very anxiety participating for him.

Mother: Oh, for sure, it’s definite. And it can through the entire day into depression. And come evening, after we do supper, and we shower, and we take our night time pills, and it’s time to brush the teeth and head to bed, don’t take mom out of the equation. If mom is not there to tuck him in, he will stay up until who knows when. It is horrible. I want to be home because I know if I’m not then he is not going to bed until I get there. I can even text. I can call and tell him goodnight, and he is still staying awake.

Tammy: That’s a lot of pressure because I think as a mom you expect that the first few years of life, right?

Mother: Yes. Yeah, you’re exactly right. You know, being a nanny. Not that I was there a lot for those kids –  I was on call 24 x 7, 365 because the family that I worked for had commitments that would pull them out at all hours of the day and night. I would go in early in the morning. I would be there late at night. I could put those kids to bed, right? Wasn’t a big deal. Or you can be like, “Ok, it’s 8:30 it’s time to go to bed”, and they go. Not with him. Oh no, you will be there, you will tuck me in. We talk about our day and then I’m going to sleep. Until then, it’s off the table. He will find any excuse possible to be up. And it’s so hard because then you’re confined to being home all the time or being with him all the time, in which case you never get a break.

Tammy: Right. And that backs up on us as moms?

Mother: Yeah.

Tammy: That affects our mental well being.

Mother: For sure.

Tammy: Because we need a break, right?

Mother: You need that break. You need that time away. Yeah you go to work in most cases.  Mom takes the kids to school and then she goes and that’s her eight hours or whatever of work. But you come home and there they are and they want to see you, and you want to see them. And so, that cycle continues. You don’t get that downtime, the time to process that you really need to so that you can stay healthy. Because it’s tough. The stress level. And of course, you start to adapt to it. But once you do, there’s a new challenge that comes your way. And then you are like, “Ok, how am I going to face this? How do we approach this?” You learn who you can lean on.

Tammy: Yeah, that’s true. You do know who your friends are, don’t you?

Mother: Yes, and you find out really quickly. Because you’ve got those friends that regardless of what you just find out, call you and say “Hey, how’s your day?”. You’ve got some family that do but really they are prying for information. They really don’t care – because they just want to know what the latest scoop is and what you find out, right?

Tammy: I see.

Mother: But I’ve got a really great friend who no matter what willl call and say “Hey, you know. I know you guys have supper schedule in 30 minutes, can we go for a quick walk?

Tammy: That’s wonderful. So you have a support system.

Mother: I do, but I’m learning that sometimes what’s convenient for her, it’s not convenient for me. And so, having to work on that because if I say, “Oh well, yes, supper is not for other 30 minutes”, “I’m leaving”. I’m sunk because now he’s home – which he’s fine being unattended for a day. I check in on him all the time. But I’ve walked in, I’ve talked to him. We’ve discussed few things. Maybe worked on homework. And now, I’m leaving. It does not go well. If I come home and I say, “Hey, I’m leaving in 30 minutes. Let’s get this, this and this done”. And then I’m going to go for a walk and I’ll be back. It’s ok.

Tammy: Because it’s all part of the plan.

Mother: Yes.

Tammy: So, spontaneity it’s sort of off the table.

Mother: Completely off the table. Whether it’s at any giving point, whether it’s changing– the beginning of the school year is always awful because the unknown in the schedule. The school year changing buildings was horrible. It took over a month to get squared away. And that was before the diagnosis, so we were clueless. And of course, I was extremely frustrated because I’m like, “Oh my goodness, man. It’s not that hard”. And now I’m like, “Oh, yeah it was”.

Tammy: It was that hard, yeah.

Mother: Because he’d smile, he’d go to school, he wouldn’t complain and now I’m thinking, “What was in his head? How is he getting through all this?” Because if that were me, I’d have been blown away. I would have been crawled up in a corner somewhere thinking, “I can’t do this”. And at his age, he went through it- I mean, yes, his behavior was a little rough. But all things considered, I was shocked.

Tammy: I think that’s something we don’t talk about enough is how incredible strong our kids are. They are managing and coping with so many things that other people can’t even see, including us, that are invisible to us.

Mother: Yes.

Tammy: And they are getting through it, and they are not getting kudos for that, right?

Mother: And that’s what I talked to a teacher about. You know, when we’ve talked about things- and kids in general-  when they are doing well, they need to know they are doing well. It’s not just that bad behavior. It can’t just be that because when they start to predict that they are that bad kid. And that their bad behavior  – no one wants to be around them. And nobody wants that.

Tammy: No, no.

Mother: You know, we’ve talked to our son about it– he has no friends.

Tammy: That’s one of the hardest parts, isn’t it? Just saying that, yeah, that’s very hard.

Mother: So in the meetings with the teachers, in the meeting with the family, I’m like, “Can you guys name who he hangs out with?”  They are usually like, “No, I guess we never paid attention.”  My family is like, “Well, I guess we’ve not really noticed that.”  Come birthday parties —  he doesn’t get invited. You know, come time for his birthday party, nobody shows up. Which…

Tammy: …it’s heartbreaking.

Mother: It is. And when it comes down to it, he doesn’t have that buddy that he wants have over on the weekend or someone who will hang out with and play video games or any of that. To see that and to talk to him about that is tough because he doesn’t see that other kids have this going on. In his mind, he’ll tell you he is friends with everyone because he’ll speak to everyone and everyone speaks to him. The response he gets may not be a friendly response, but in his mind, “Hey, they talk to me”.

Tammy: Does that worry you in terms of him being teased or bullied?

Mother: Yes, because it’s happened already.

Tammy: So, he thinks someone is being his friend but they are actually not treating him well?

Mother: Yes. Perfect example of that it would have been late fall. He was riding the bus. And he could tell the name of this other student that he walked to a corner with and the student went one way and he went another to come home. And it was just like casual talk about this person who were there. But then at one point I tried- I texted him, to see what was taking him so long to get home because I’ve got the alerts that it go off when he gets within so many feet of the house so that I know he’s home. So for my peace of mind I can rest a bit. You know? And he wasn’t getting home on time. And so, I texted his phone and I said, “Hey, can you tell me why you are running late?” And I got a really weird response back. Not a normal response from my child. So, I picked up the phone and I called. And someone answered it but there was no hello really quickly on the other end of the phone. And once he got on the phone I said, “What is going on?” And he’s like, Oh, well, so-and-so had my phone. And I said, “We’ll discuss this when you get home, but I’m going to keep talking to you until you walk the other way, and I know that you are home. And when I get home, we’ll talk”. When I got home that night, we talked about it. He said “when I got my phone out of my bag pack like I always do every day and I unlocked it and she reached over and took it from me.” And he is like, “Mom, I don’t understand why you are mad. She was just joking”. [I said] “No, that’s not a joking behavior”. I said, “What were you told at school?”. “Oh, yeah, we’re not supposed to touch other people’s property”. And I said, “Is your phone your property?”. “Yeah”. I said, “See? That is not acceptable behavior. What else has she done to you?” Feel free to tell me. I need to know these things so that we can take care of you. Of course she was shoving and picking on him. I said, “Can you explain to me how or why you think that she is your friend? He said, “But we talk”. “No buddy, that doesn’t make anyone your friend. A friend is going to stick up for you. A friend is going to be there when you are having a bad day to cheer you up. Shoving someone around, calling you names, taking your phone, that is not acceptable behavior”. But we are also talking about a child who got kicked in the groin in the kindergarten and has permanent damage from it.

Tammy: Oh, poor guy.

Mother: When that happened, we weren’t told.

Tammy: Really?

Mother: Not at all. We brought him home. I brought him from home school that day. Nothing was said. There was nothing in the bag pack. No phone call, no email. I went to put him in the tub that night and his whole groin area was black and blue.

Tammy: Oh, the poor guy.

Mother: So, of course, that result in mom being, “what happened to you?” And by the way, dad needs to come check you out because that’s totally awkward for mom to do it.

Tammy: Was he able to explain what happened?

Mother: He told me that another child was holding the door open when they were walking in from recess and the other child decided to kick him.

Tammy: But he didn’t think to tell anyone?

Mother: He told the teacher who said, “You’ll be ok”, and told the other student to settle down. He wasn’t sent to the office and I said, “I understand you all can’t check his groin. I get that. But a phone call so that I could have come to check him out.

Tammy: Make sure he is ok.

Mother: Or the offer of an ice pack would have been nice, but instead we find it at 8 o’clock at night when we are putting him to bed.

Mother: He went to the doctor the next day. He has a testicle that’s lodged up inside from this.

Tammy: How old was he at the time?

Mother: Six.

Tammy: Oh goodness.

Mother: To make matters worse, for three months twice a day I had to try to manually move that.

Tammy: Oh, poor kid.

Mother: How awkward for him and I both, right?

Tammy: Oh, absolutely.

Mother: When the other child- they called that child’s parents. It was, “Well, I know that sounds bad but, he’s like, what did he do to deserve it?”. That’s what was said back to us. So he’d had issues and again. He thought that kid was his friend. I was just thinking, “Buddy, you deserve so much better than this”. You’re such a good kid.

Tammy: That’s hard. So, we ask everybody at this moment, right now, do you feel like you’re swimming, draining water, drowning, what do you feel like you are at?

Mother: Treading water. We’re- we’re getting there. Two weeks ago I would say we were sinking immensely. Um, we’ve come a little bit- we’re getting a little ground. So I can ease up a bit but as summer’s coming, I’ll be drowning here soon.

Tammy: Yeah. Summer is tough.

Mother: It is. And trying to figure it all out for them.

Tammy: What do you do then? Like, what’s your self-care routine or if more relevant, what do you to survive those tough times?

Mother: I turn a lot to my camera. Whether it’s loading up my son and we go to a sporting event and I know it’s something that he will want to watch, and I’ll take pictures. And then I can go home and be on the computer and edit those. Just kind of not really completely shut everything out but be in that bubble. And just focus on the task at hand and not have to worry quite as much. It helps immensely.

Tammy: That sounds great. So, through all of this, what do you think has been your most laughable moment?

Mother: I know this sounds really bad, but watching my son talk to his therapist and get a full idea on his diagnosis, because he himself grasps it now. And he laughs at what we see and so we can laugh with him over it. Because it was so stressful to even get him to go to the therapist. And now he’s comfortable there. He knows that what we are working on it’s not a life-threatening thing. And he can joke with us about things like that now which eases family tensions so much. I know that’s a tough thing to really have us a laughable moment. But come the end of the day it’s made things so much easier for all of us that he’s taking us with this with a grain of salt. He laughs, he jokes, and he understands what’s going on. Taking him to the doctor was another good one. The poor kid had four shots.I laugh as I’m holding him.

Tammy: Right. Every mom, every dad can relate to this. No one likes their shots.

Mother: No. And we’re- we’re strategizing right? Like, “Okay, don’t look. Look at mom. Mom is across the table. Don’t watch the nurse”. You know? And he’s screaming at the top of his lungs. We’re thinking, “Come on, it’s okay. You’ve got four of them, it won’t take long”. And he watched the first shot and he’s like, “Wow, what’s the big deal here?”. He’s like, “That didn’t hurt”. We could let go. And he laid there.

Tammy: And it was nothing.

Mother: No, it was nothing. He is like, “No big deal”.

Tammy: That’s great, that’s great.

Mother: So, he provides a lot of laughable moments for us.

Tammy: Yeah. Well, that’s awesome. Well, thank you so much for sharing your story with us.

Mother: Well, thank you.

Voice: You have been listening to “Just Ask Mom”, recorded and copyrighted in 2017 by Mothers on the Frontline. Today’s podcast host was Tammy Nyden. The music is “Olde English” written, performed, and recorded by FlameEmoji. For more podcasts in this and other series relating to children’s mental health, go to MothersOnTheFronline.com.

 

Disruptive Mood Dysregulation Disorder and what a good day looks like. Just Ask Mom Podcast Series, episode 8

In this episode, we speak with a mother of three. Her eldest son has Disruptive Mood Dysregulation Disorder (DMDD). She discusses how the condition affects the family dynamic and what a good day looks like.

Transcription

Voice: Welcome to the Just Ask Mom podcast where parents share their experiences of mothering children with mental illness.  Just Ask Mom is a Mothers on the Frontline production. Today we speak with a mother of three. Her eldest son has Disruptive Mood Dysregulation Disorder (DMDD).

Tammy: So why don’t you tell us a bit about yourself?

Mother: I have 3 kids, 3 boys, ages 1 to 12. My oldest son has a mental health diagnosis. He’s right now diagnosed with the DMDD. Disruptive Mood Dysregulation Disorder. He was severely violent, had to be removed from the home for a total of about a year and 8 months, 2 different placements. Now he’s in the home, he’s non-violent for the most part but I have worked and then trained to restrain him, if need be. And I also went to school and have my Bachelor’s degree in Human Services. I switched to human services because of him.

Tammy: Very good. So, before we start, I’m going to ask you to tell us a little bit about yourself before or beyond mothering?

Mother: Well, before mothering, I was a teenager. So there wasn’t a whole lot going on. But it wasn’t until recently that I started to decide that other than mothering, I needed some hobbies. Most of my time was just spent mothering. So, I decided to help with just giving myself something to do other than the kids. I’m really into running. But I don’t like running in the cold. So then I had to figure out something to do outside of running to really get rid some of my stress so, then decide to start painting and like kind like those wine and canvasses people go to. But I don’t drink, so I find them on YouTube and I do them at home. And so, for about their hour worth of work it takes me about 3, but I do the paintings at home.

Tammy: Oh fun.

Mother: And so I really like [it]. I do painting and running.

Tammy: Very nice. So, I want to ask you to pretend you’re talking to your coworkers, right? What would you want them to know about your experiences as a mom?

Mother: Just how much time and effort it puts in, not with just my mental health son but all of my children and that trying to balance, making sure all the kids have the attention they need. I don’t think anyone realizes outside of our household really what it takes to raise a child with mental health needs. What a typical night looks like in our house, it’s not just having fun and getting through homework, it’s a very regimen routine. We have to stay very on top of our routine, we can’t just fly by the seat of our pants. Everything is very much — 3 out of 5 nights during the week we have appointments. The other nights are ball practices. Everything is laid out on calendars. We can’t go off of the routine otherwise we spend the whole night with a kid that’s having a meltdown because we went off of a routine and he didn’t expect that. It’s a very much different type of household and very much a different type of atmosphere having a household where there’s somebody that, you know, has a mentality of a 4-year-old and he’s 12.

Tammy: How do you keep that schedule because a household is not an institution, things happen — like you have to cook dinner and so on. How do you try to maintain the schedule? Can you give examples of how it’s hard to do that at times?

Mother: It is extremely hard to do. It means a lot of times where I’m one-on-one with my son and we both are left out of doing things as a family. On a lot of times, it’s just me and my oldest son. We’re together if he’s having a rough day– it’s me and him having a rough day together. It’s me and him that are together all of the time. Luckily, I am blessed with having an employer, and it’s taken me 12 years to find an employer that completely understands. I work for a school district where the principal came from a large school district and he understands mental health and he allows me to be home when my son needs me to be home because we don’t want my son not to make it through this. And so when my son can’t get out of bed and can’t make it to school, I’m allowed to stay home. But me and my son are very much left out of the rest of the family. My 16-month-old son, him and my husband and my other son go and do a lot without us if my oldest can’t go. And that’s terrible and that’s–it’s very sad, I don’t mind it so much and people, “Oh, poor you.” [but] I’ve lived my childhood, it’s not poor me, it’s too bad for my 12-year-old, it’s very heartbreaking for him. I don’t care what I miss out on, I care that my son can’t live a normal childhood. It’s heartbreaking for him. it doesn’t matter what I miss out on.  I just wish he could have a childhood and that’s where it hurts the most is to see him suffer and to see he can’t get out of bed because it’s Friday and I don’t even know most time why he can’t get out of bed and the voices in his head are mad at him that day and they’re telling him that he’s going to get hurt at school when he knows he’s not going to. That doesn’t make sense to most people.

Tammy: I think it’s hard to see any of your kids suffer in any way and this is particularly difficult, right?

Mother: Yeah. And I cut his chicken wrong, so now he has to go bed for the night, I mean, that’s…what?

Tammy: Do feel like you’re walking on eggshells sometimes?

Mother: All the time. All the time, and really you just can’t get mad at him for it because he can’t control it. You just have to let it go and be like, “Okay, well, that’s how our nights going to go.” Like, alright, cool.

Tammy: So, right now where would you say you are? Do you feel like you’re swimming, drowning, or treading water at this moment? Because for many of us, it differs from moment to moment.

Mother: It does, I feel like everything’s hour by hour. Monday, he didn’t make it to school but today’s Wednesday and so I feel he’s at school and I–so I’m treading water. Meds are doing okay, we’ve made it to everything today and I haven’t gotten a call, so I’m treading water pretty good.

Tammy: That’s a good day.

Mother: That’s a good day.

Tammy: That’s a good day.

Mother: He’s at school and I’m doing what I want to do so it’s a good day.

Tammy: That’s awesome. So, what’s your self-care routine or if more appropriate, survival technique?

Mother: Survival technique would be to know when to walk away. I’m not a single mother doing this–know when to tap out with my husband. If my son is getting– he doesn’t get physically aggressive anymore but verbally aggressive — it’s to know when I’m getting verbally aggressive back or when I feel like I’m getting upset. It’s to know when to tap out with my husband. Or even to listen to my husband when he’s like, “You need to stop and you need to walk away. You need a break.” So that’s my survival technique. Self-care is just to take time for myself. It was my 30th birthday recently and my best friend made me take the day off and we went to the mall not to shop but to do like get our nails done and to get the 5-minute massage. That sort of thing. I’s just taking time for yourself.

Tammy: That’s so important. What do you think is your most laughable moment?

Mother: I couldn’t think of a most laughable moment but it’s just finding something to laugh at. Because every day there’s something funny to laugh at and everybody gets so stressed out. It’s just always finding something funny for the day.

Tammy: Wonderful, is there anything else you’d like people to know?

Mother: I don’t think so. It’s just about reaching out to someone. Somebody’s going through something and just making sure — everybody’s having a hard time and there’s always someone having a bad day. So if someone treats you like crap, you know, just realize they’re going through something.

Tammy: That’s a great advice. Thank you so much for sharing your story with us.

Mother: Yes, thank you.

Voice: You have been listening to “Just Ask Mom”, recorded and copyrighted in 2017 by Mothers on the Frontline. Today’s podcast host was Tammy Nyden. The music is “Olde English” written, performed, and recorded by FlameEmoji. For more podcasts in this and other series relating to children’s mental health, go to MothersOnTheFronline.com.

[End]

Filling up your cup, so it can run over for others, Just Ask Mom Podcast Series, episode 7

In this episode, Alissa shares her journey as a single mother raising 5 children, both biological and adopted through the foster system, and having a wide range of special needs, including physical, intellectual and emotional disabilities. She discusses how to stay centered in the tough times and how self-care is required before we are able to give to others, including our children.

 

Transcription

Voice: Welcome to the Just Ask Mom podcast where mothers share their experiences of raising children with mental illness.  Just Ask Mom is a Mothers on the Frontline production. Today we are speaking with Alissa, a mother of five children, including biological children and children adopted through the foster system. She works in Human Services helping other families with mental health needs as well as other special needs.

Tammy: Well, why don’t you tell us a little bit about yourself, to get started.

Alissa: My name is Alissa Tschetter-Siedschlaw. I am a mom of five. I’ve been a single mom for ten years, although I recently got engaged.

Tammy:  Congratulations.

Alissa: Thank you.

Tammy: Oh, that’s exciting.

Alissa: My children range in age from 24 down to 9. I have both children that are biologically born to me, and children adopted through the foster system, with a wide variety of mental health, developmental, behavioral, and medical special needs. I work full time, well, actually no, I’m part time now, in human services, helping other families. I also do professional theater, by contract.

Tammy: I didn’t know that. That’s really cool.

Alissa: You didn’t? I finished a contract recently and I have a Shakespeare contract coming up in the summer.

Tammy: Oh, how fun.

Alissa: Yup. That’s what my training was originally in, theater performance.

Tammy: Well, my next question –  and you might have partially answered this –  what are you passionate about? Tell us a bit about you, outside of, or before mothering.

Alissa:  I am passionate about arts. I’m passionate about advocating for those who can’t speak for themselves. I was before this. I’m passionate about taking care of the earth, taking care of other people, treating people the way you would want to be treated yourself, trying to make a difference, and fighting against – whether it’s discrimination, or fighting against systems that don’t understand where loopholes are for people, or whatever. I’ve always been passionate about those political things and those kinds of things. I love lots of forms of art and exercise. I like to exercise. That is my medication. So yeah, those are the things.

Tammy: Great. Well, that’s awesome. So I want you to pretend that you’re talking to — In your case, you have five children, with multiple special needs, so I’d like you to pretend you’re talking to a parent with, maybe two or three kids that don’t have special needs. And try to give them some insight into what are the extra challenges.

Alissa: I think, it would be almost impossible to explain to someone else in that circumstance. What I would probably welcome them to do is come see a day in my life, or experience another family like mine. Because there’s a lot of things you don’t know until you know. A lot of very compassionate, very loving people, can say very callous things, because truly, –  it’s never crossed their mind. They’ve never thought about the kinds of problems we might have before. So sometimes, I try to explain from a place of education – without being patronizing- sometimes, just even in gaining compassion, when I have one child that I adopted, who has a tremendously tragic story. There’s not many people you could explain such a rough beginning and not pull at their heartstrings, and then, say all the things that her life is like now, and how it is to go home to a child, who’s functioning much slower than her physical size, who might have a psychotic break, and bite you, and attack you. People have a hard time even wrapping their head around those things, so I kind of wish more people could peek into our lives, because it is such a hard thing to understand. I think it’s like a lot of things that might seem unpleasant to people. We all want to pretend that certain things aren’t out there. It makes you feel like you can survive.  I know myself –  there are times when you hear some horrendous child abuse story – we all want tp  say, “No, that’s not, it can’t be. That’s not real.” Sometimes I think, our lives can look like that. I think it’s very scary to those who don’t experience that. I think it’s also why we so easily bond with each other, because so rarely do moms like us truly feel understood.

Tammy: Yeah.

Alissa: Where maybe if I am in an IEP meeting and seem snappy and bitchy or something, other moms like me would get it and go, “You know what? You’re just cutting out the BS, because you’re tired, and you’ve probably been up all night and this is your third meeting of the day, and I get you.” Where, to an outside person, it’s like “Wow this mom is difficult to deal with”. I think so much of it would be welcoming somebody in, to see a picture of what it looks like. Because I don’t think it’s something most people can wrap their head around.

Tammy: It’s interesting you say that, because even if you had a video of it, it’s still removed, because…

Alissa: …because you’re not in it, yeah.

Tammy: I don’t know the neurology of this, I just know when my child has anxiety and I’m in the same room with my child, it starts to affect my body.

Alissa: Oh, absolutely.

Tammy: So if you’re in a situation like this, day in and day out.

Alissa: Well, it absolutely does. I actually think some of the best things, you know, you maybe ask what this in a little bit –  but some of the best things I’ve done for myself, have to do with energy worth, and learning how to stay centered and calm, in the midst of chaos, rather than allowing yourself to snowball in the chaos. And realizing that chaos isn’t me, and it isn’t my own. And so, to be able to stay calm and centered in the midst of that, does reduce behavior of those around you, just naturally. It’s like tossing a pebble into a pond, and watching the ripple. If my pebble is a calm and centered and neutral pebble, it doesn’t get pulled into that. Because anxiety’s contagious.

Tammy: Absolutely.

Alissa: And it’s very, very easy for that to happen. And I would say, over the last six years, doing a lot of work, with my own therapist, with my own energy person, with a lot of alternative things like that, finding ways to do what I can do, because I can only do me when it comes down to it you know. And so, hopefully, my ripple is different. That helps reduce the amount of severity of my own reaction to the children.

Tammy: If it’s okay, I’d like to follow that up, because it’s one thing I notice, when I’m around the other moms, who go through this. I realize I’m drawn to them more than other people now. And part of it is like you say, they understand. But there’s something else, and it’s hard for me to sometimes put my finger on it. I think, in order to survive this, you have to do exactly what you said. To some extent, you have to center yourself. You have to understand that, if I’m going survive this, I have to not be carried away with it. And that’s a life skill that transfers everywhere else.

Alissa: It absolutely does. I think, in general a lot of moms like us tend to be overtly authentic. Which I love. For some people, that’s extremely off putting. Because I’ll just tell you flat out.

Tammy: [laughs] Yeah.

Alissa: You have a question you want to ask me, or somebody wants to discuss some topic. I don’t care. I’ll tell –  because, I think, when you’ve gone through these kinds of things, it is just different. I do think there is an ability to be raw and authentic, in a way that I think is a tremendous life skill, that I have gained, from a very difficult experience. Yeah.

Tammy: Right. Well, thank you for that. That is really helpful. So you have five kids. And I know just having two, how difficult it can be, making sure the sibling is getting attention, and so on. What do you wish you could tell your kids? Like, and you could pick a few, if you want, like one of the time…

Alissa: Absolutely.

Tammy: That’s five intersecting lives and so many various complicated ways…

Alissa: Well, the one thing I do know that my kids know is that I would fiercely and vigilantly fight for what they need. Unfortunately, looking back, I feel like I have been more of an advocate than I have been a mom. That part hurts my heart. I didn’t have all of the sit down and play and do fun things together, or let’s go do some fun activity, especially when I had so many with so many special needs. Our activities were physical therapy, occupational therapy, speech therapy, behavioral therapy, treatment, med management. I grieve that – that I don’t think my children will look back and remember me as a fun mom. I don’t think they’ll have those memories. But I do think my kids would tell, “If you were in a pinch, who do you want in your corner? It was my mom.” So that part I’m proud of. What I’ve had to do –  this usually does make me emotional – is let myself off the hook a bit because under the given circumstances, especially being alone for so much of it, I did the best I could, with what I had at the time. I apologize when I need to. I make the kids aware that I am a human, with faults, and I am so sorry, but I’m doing my best, and how much I love and adore you. I believe in a higher power, and God brought us together for a reason. And no matter what, even when I’m confused, and I don’t know what the reason is, or any of those things, I’m confident in that. I try to stick with that. That part can be, can be hard- I don’t think anyone has gotten the individual attention they may have needed. But I’ve tried to do simple things like take one to the grocery store. Even have one run down to the laundry just for a few minutes, here and there, I try to make sure everybody gets touched, every day. Especially when they get older, and they’re teenagers, that you get a hug goodbye and I’ll give you a kiss goodbye – that they feel physical love and affection from their mom. I think that they all know I wish I could have provided more.

Tammy:  Your story is one that, almost of us, would resonate with, because we don’t talk about it very much, but I think we all also grieve, not only the loss of the motherhood we imagined, but the childhood be imagined for our kids. All of that.

Alissa: Exactly. Well, the other really nice thing is– and I don’t know why –  I think I’ve always been a little bit of an odd duck, myself– I didn’t have expectations of what my kids would be. I didn’t. I actually think that has saved me a level of grief, that I know a lot of my peers have gone through. For the children that I adopted, there was this weird freedom from it. I don’t have guilt about their beginnings being crappy. I didn’t do it. And the neat thing about that is, I also know what they would’ve had without me and go, “You know, what? I’m doing pretty good because, you would have had worse.” It’s not that I still don’t feel like I wish I could give them more, but there is a sense of forgiving myself, when I know, okay, you know what? I know what your options were without me, so we’re doing okay. I do think I’ve grieved the mom that I wish I was. But I really want my kids to just be whoever they are. Especially with my adoptions. One of my children, they said she would basically be a vegetable. That is what I planned for. Anything above that is just bonus. So all of the issues she has today, when I look at her situation, this poor kid, I just think, this is just such a miraculous kid. I didn’t have expectations of her doing X, Y, or Z.

Tammy: That’s another thing. If we could transfer the rest of our lives, right? Just think about all of our relationships, all of our daily things, if we didn’t lead with expectations.

Alissa: I think, actually, that centered skill, being able to feel whole myself, it sets me up for much healthier relationships, because I don’t go in with expectation. If I’m here just to love you, then that’s all I’m here for. If you love me back, bonus. But I’m not here with an expectation of you offering me something in return. I view parenting much that way. It is our job to love them. It is not their job to love us back. That’s bonus. That’s gravy. That’s what we would hope for. But if they don’t, that’s not part of the journey. That’s not my job -to be your friend or to be liked by you. My job is to raise the best human being I can raise. My job is to love you unconditionally and with without expectation of being loved in return. Feeling okay with yourself, frees you that way, and helps your relationships be really authentic, really real, and you can have much deeper relationships, because you’re cutting out that expectation.

Tammy: I think that’s wonderful. So right now, at this moment, because every mom I talked to, including myself —

Alissa: A little different.

Tammy: — it varies from moment to moment.

Alissa: Right.

Tammy: But in this moment, are you treading water? Are you drowning? Are you swimming? Where do you find yourself?

Alissa: If I’m doing swimming, as the most positive of the options, I think we’re mostly swimming.

Tammy: Good.

Alissa: I think there are days we’re treading water. We aren’t sinking so much anymore, but I have had plenty of days where the goal was only to survive the day. In fact, I think, there was a decade there where I survived the decade –  my goal was only to survive the day. I still probably have poor long-term planning, because thinking too far out causes me stress and anxiety, because of that. So sometimes I have poor planning –  what are you doing in three weeks. I have no idea what I’m doing in three weeks. I’ll put it on my schedule. I’ll look the night before, because I will be overwhelmed otherwise. Over all I do feel like we’re at least always two steps forward, even though we take one step back.  If you had told me five years ago we could be this good, I would have thought you were out your mind. So that’s exciting.

Tammy: I think it’s really good for people to hear. I know the biggest hope I get is when I talk to parents whose kids are now adults and they made it and they’re okay. And it was hard, but they’re okay. It just gives you so much hope.

Alissa: I think hope is one of the most pivotal things to hang on to, because your only option isn’t to sink. There are people out there. Are the resources what I wish they were? They are not. And do I see all kinds of holes, and all kinds of systems all over the place? I sure do. But that doesn’t mean there isn’t hope. We had come a really, really long way. We had a lot of near tragedy along the way too, and we have survived. I’d like to get to a place — I don’t know if I would say we are at thriving as opposed to surviving –but we’re somewhere in the middle and that’s pretty dang good. 

Tammy: That’s really good.

Alissa: So, yeah.

Tammy: You’ve already talked a little bit about your self-care routine, but if you want to say anything more about it or in those really rough moments – the survival techniques.

Alissa: I tell lots of people to remember to breathe. Literally. I don’t think we realize how often we’re holding our breath. The difference it makes in your physical body to remind yourself to breathe. My Mommy Mantra is, “This too shall pass.”  Nothing is forever even in the worst of circumstance, this won’t always be like this. No matter what, this will change and I remind myself of that a lot. I try to exercise most days, not every day — but that does help. I also see a therapist for me. I do some energy work with an energy person when I need meds myself, I go get meds. It’s usually in the winter. I’m like you know what, I need some extra help because I’m struggling. And there’s nothing wrong with that. I think remembering that, utilizing what’s out there to be the best who you can be. We also shouldn’t think that we should be a doormat. I’ll go get my nails done. I mean, maybe not all the time, but if there’s something that is splurge, you know, I — I’m on the list too. A lot of us forget that. I don’t think you can do the quality job you want if you’re cup’s empty.

Tammy: That’s right.

Alissa: I heard someone say once –and I loved it so much–they talked about when people say, “My cup runneth over.” And what they were saying is, “You know what? What runneth over is for me to give you. What’s in the cup is for me.”

Tammy: Ah.

Alissa: And so, if you think of it that way. I have to do my best to keep my own cup full or I’ve got nothing to offer, to my children, to others, to advocacy, to change, you know, I’ve got to do my best to keep myself whole and intact as well, you know, or it does no one any good.

Tammy: Thank you. This is just amazing.

Alissa: Thank you.

Tammy: I’m going to ask you one last question. Through all this, what’s your most laughable moment?

Alissa: One of my favorite moments, so, a little bit about my daughter – she is 17. She’s intellectually disabled. She’s probably functioning around seven and she has cerebral palsy. She has schizophrenia. She had a severe – grade 3 – bilateral brain bleed. She has hydrocephalus with a shunt. She’s meth and alcohol affected. She was three months premature and her birth parents are related. So, what basket a stuff to be given. But this is one of my favorite stories about her. I home-schooled her up until third grade. And then in third grade she went to public school. She comes home and she’s telling me the story about how she and the other black girls in class were having a discussion. I realized as she went on that she thought she was black and so I said, “Madeline, did you know you’re not black”, and she said, “What?”, and she fell straight over on to the couch in shock. Then she’s like, “Well, w-what am I?”, and I said, “Well, I think you’re Italian”, and she said, “I must have gotten confused.” [laughter] It was so cute. And another really cute one I have to say about my son who’s autistic. This was just his — the way he thought it worked. At 18, he sat down to come out of the closet as straight. He figured every kid –  like each parent –  you don’t know. And then, you wait until adulthood and then apparently each child needs to sit their parents down and explain whether you are straight or gay. I just thought it was the cutest thing that one he thought that there’s no concern about what you might be, but that, he better inform me.

Tammy: Right. That’s his job.

Alissa: That he is straight.

Tammy: To tell you at this age.

Alissa: Yes. Yes. So it was cute because he came out as straight.

Tammy: That’s great. Thank you so much.

Alissa: You’re welcome.

Tammy: Such a wonderful story.

Alissa: Thank you so much, Tammy.

Tammy: Thank you.

Voice: You have been listening to “Just Ask Mom”, recorded and copyrighted in 2017 by Mothers on the Frontline. Today’s podcast host was Tammy Nyden. The music is “Olde English” written, performed, and recorded by FlameEmoji. For more podcasts in this and other series relating to children’s mental health, go to MothersOnTheFronline.com.

[End]

When they see your child as “different” and turn away. Just Ask Mom Podcast Series, Episode 6

In this episode, a mother and grandmother from Iowa talk about the difficult journey of changing diagnoses, medications, and symptoms during the early childhood of their son and grandson who has Tourette’s Syndrome, OCD, and ODD. They discuss the importance of support groups, recognizing your own needs (especially when they might be different than the needs of your family members) and making sure to honor them. In their case, the need to be social and get out with other people.

 

Transcription

Speaker: Welcome to the Just Ask Mom podcast where mothers share their experiences of raising children with mental illness.  Just Ask Mom is a Mothers on the Frontline production. Today we will speak with a mother and Grandmother from Iowa. Today they will be speaking about their elementary school-aged son and grandson who has Tourette’s Syndrome.

 

Tammy: Today we’re doing something a little bit different. We have a mother-daughter pair. I’m going to ask you both to just tell us a little bit about yourselves?

Mom: Okay, I’m an Iowa mom. I have a son who has Tourette’s, OCD and ODD –  major diagnosis there. Yes, some other ones too. He’s at grade school and we live in Iowa.

Tammy: Great.

Grandmother: And I’m the grandmother of a grandson with mental health issues and I’m here to support my daughter and my grandson.

Tammy: Great. So before we get started, I’m going ask each of you just to tell us a little bit about yourself before mothering. What were your passions? Or outside of mothering, what do you enjoy or when you fantasized about the kid’s going off and you having a moment to yourself, what would you do? [Laughs] So just what’s interesting to you as a person?

Mom: Oh boy. [Laughs] Let’s see. I used to like to sleep. [Laughs] Like I would sleep, stay up watching movies on TV and then go to bed late and stay up late and then sleep in late.

Tammy: That sounds so nice.

Mom: Yeah. [Laughing]

Grandmother: And I as the grandmother, prefer reading. Used to enjoy dancing but as the kid’s say, “Oh, yuck! Not that.”[Laughing] and gardening. I like to garden and just be current. Go on little road trips. I do fantasize having a palm tree in my front yard and a big lounge chair on each side.

Tammy: That does — especially during the winters. That’s a very attractive thought.

Grandmother: Yes. Not, not a real palm tree –  artificial – so I don’t have to worry about it dying but –that would be happy. That’s looking at happy in my eyes. Joy.

Mom: If going ‘happy’, I want the in ground pool at the backyard. [Laughs]

Tammy: [Laughing]. That sounds good too.

Grandmother: Just a fantasy.

Tammy: Awesome. Well, I want to ask you to pretend you’re talking to families who are feeling lost. They don’t have a diagnosis yet for their child but they know something’s going on. I’m wondering if you could tell us what would you say to those mothers? What would you say to family members or relatives, grandparents? As families are going through this and trying to determine what’s going on with their child?

Mom: I would just say something that helped me was to just research, research, research. Again, the internet, I googled everything. You know and then we kind of fell into a support group that helped us. There was a children’s therapy center. We didn’t actually go there for therapy because our insurance didn’t cover it. But we found out that they have a support group there on Saturday mornings. So we thought, you know, let’s just go and try this and see if we can meet other people that have kids that may have issues that can help us and stir us where to go. And so that really was our saving grace.

Grandmother: That’s true. I find — getting into this in my estimation, doctors really don’t know a whole lot. And each doctor you talk to has a different field of expertise. And they want to lead you down the path that they think you should go. Even though it may not be the right path. And so you’ll go down that path and you realized nothing is changing. So then you go back and you try and find another doctor. You start all over again and hope for the best. And that may not be, it either, it, it just is — it’s been — with the support group and talking to other parents that have saved us in. It took, it took months before we were actually able to face the fact that well, my grandson had a mental illness. We did not have it at least recognized in the family before if it was there. No one knew about. No one was directed to any special person to take care of it. So it was new to us and we were, we were just lost. We were just– Basically, we were, we were out to sea and we have no life line until we found the children’s center and then we found out that there are other people who are in that similar situation that we’re in.

Tammy: I think one of the things with children’s mental health, in particular, — what you’re saying so far is true of any kind of illness, right? Physical, mental. If you don’t, it — just finding out what it is, you’re at sea until you know what’s going on. What’s particularly difficult with children’s mental illness is their brains are developing and changing. So even if you get a diagnosis, that might change. So you can be lost, found for a little bit, lost again [laughs]. I’m just wondering if you’re can talk about?  Has that been some of your experiences as well? I mean it’s such a journey and how does having a support group help? Even once you find that support group — is that journey helped with the support group as well or…?

Mom: Well, I mean the support group has definitely helped us because there were periods where we would go through really, really deep lows with what was going in the family. Then you kind of get to a point where you can celebrate one day [laughs] One horrible month might have a good day and you need to learn to celebrate that. It just helped us going to the support group and talking with other people because they would sometimes say the same thing and we could learn that the kids’ behaviors might be based on seasonal changes –  or just significant life changes.

Grandmother: Yes. Children don’t like change in their lives. And it often happens. They can’t prevent it. And they don’t know how to deal with it when it does happen to them. We found through dealing with all of this that we have to try to change with them and help them through it. Medication was a big thing. What might work for two weeks will suddenly not work at all and then you get another medication. Pretty soon several medications and it just does not work for their little bodies.

Tammy: Yeah. There’s so much changing at once, it’s hard to know what’s doing what. I think that’s right. What do you want people to know as their trying to navigate this? So reaching out is one thing. I’m hearing.  How do you manage to have hope during that time? To sort of push your way through and take care of yourself during that time? Because it’s rough. It gets pretty dark, when you’re not sure what’s wrong with your child because we want our kids okay. We want to keep them safe.

Grandmother: And when you do find out, often times, you are, sad to say, shunned.

Tammy: Yes.

Grandmother: Because you have a child that’s different from most of the children in the neighborhood. And they look at you and say, “We know who you are but we prefer not to be with you because your child is different. Your child cannot relate to ours”. And, and in our case, we have a child who can relate better with adults than with children.  – He can start talking to any adult on their level and I have had many of them come back to me and say, “What a nice young man you have there. Very pleasurable, very knowledgeable. Very nice”. But on his pure level, he just cannot communicate with them. They don’t essentially get him. And that has been extremely difficult for him and difficult for me because I know he’s trying so hard. But they just don’t see it. And oh the pain just hurts so bad to see them making fun of him. But I don’t, I don’t know how to combat that, we just go on our merry way as best as we can.

Tammy: Yeah. It’s so painful to see your child suffer, but when it’s out of the cruelness of someone else…

Grandmother: …it’s even worse…

Tammy: …it’s worse…

Grandmother: Yes.

Tammy: I think because that can be helped, right?

Grandmother: It can.

Mom: A lot of it is just the misunderstanding. Because they don’t understand what’s going on with that other kid because the kid looks “normal”. They’re thinking, “Why is the kid doing those weird things. Why is he saying those weird things? Why is he acting like that?” Sometimes you hope that if you would just explain it to them, they would get it and they would understand more. And sometimes they don’t. And sometimes it just takes more education and they do end up understanding more and coming along and then they get a better picture of what’s going. I would still say just reaching out to other people because even in the support group we found a couple people within the group that we were able to reach out in really difficult times and just call them or text them or email them and say, “I need you to meet me for a coffee out my backyard”. [Laughs]. Because I’m barely holding on by a string. So just making that point with somebody else. To know that they’re there. And then you talk and you laugh for like 20 minutes. And then you could go back to doing what you were doing. You can go back to fighting.

Grandmother: Yes, it is important to have someone that you can maybe bond with over your problems that might have the same problem.

Tammy: Yeah, I think that’s important. So, we’ve been asking everyone this – and from my own experience, it changes from moment to moment – most people I talk to say the same thing – so at this moment, where do you find yourself? Do you feel like you’re swimming, drowning, treading water? Where do you find yourself?

[Laughing]

Grandmother: At this moment, not last night.

[Laughing]

Mom: I know. Because there’s never a dull moment. There’s always a new development. And always relates to social issues, I swear.

Grandmother: Well your 11th-year-old son likes girls now.

Mom: Oh my goodness.[Laughs]. Uhm, swimming, drowning or treading water?

Tammy: Yeah.

Mom: Treading water. Today?

Tammy: Yeah, today.

Mom: Today, okay. As of this morning, we were swimming.

Grandmother: [Laughing]

Tammy: Let’s talk about that. That’s a big deal because I, I find on my own experience – and I’m talking to a lot of moms –  it changes

Mom: By the hour.

Tammy and Mom: By the hour.

Tammy: Yeah.

Mom: It really does.

Tammy: And that itself can be very almost traumatizing because you can’t play, you can’t think ahead.

Mom: It’s interesting because I was just thinking about that on the way here because I kept thinking it takes me longer to recover from an episode than it does him.

Tammy: (in a whisper) Yeah.

Mom: And so that was part of my thing today going. I need to try and regroup and get it together and pull myself together from one of the episodes that happened last night with him and other kids because of social issues. He recovered. He went to bed last night and woke up this morning and had a good day and it was fine and everything’s good. But the grandmother and the mother are still going [made a sigh of relief] “Oh, boy.”

Tammy: Yeah. What can we do in times like that? Because that’s true, right? There’s this all-of-a-sudden “okay, everything’s fine” and we’re like, “No, it’s not”.

Grandmother: You dropped him off. You thought things were fine. Yet and then you get the phone call.

Mom: Well, we were excited because he’s trying to reach out and make new friends.  And he did make a couple of new friends and he was texting them on his phone. And so then it was one of those things where, “okay, he wants to get together with new friends”. And then you know, just in a course of like 2 minutes of him getting together with new friends, it took a really bad turn. That negative thing happened and then he was like, “I want to leave: you need to come get me”. Sometimes you think you’re doing so well and you think, “Oh good, he’s making friends. He’s reaching out and these other friends are reaching out to him” and then all-of-a-sudden you find out, in a bad moment, the kids really weren’t being friends or that other kids were involved and they were definitely bullies…

Grandmother: …taking advantage of him…

Mom: — “Oh, good we finally going down the right road”. But then you, and in just 2 minutes it subsides down and then you have to re-evaluate, weigh everything again.  Yeah. So, reaching out because I will go out with two girlfriends tonight and have dinner and drinks. “That’s how I’m going to cope.  I was going to cancel that because then my child was having some kids over and I said, “too bad”. My husband is just going take care of it because I’m going out with those girls. Because I need to go out with those girls. And then tomorrow, I’m going to go to lunch and a play with somebody that I know because if I don’t get out of the house this weekend then I’m not, I’m not going make it. Because I’m just at the end of my rope.

Tammy: This gets into the next question: what is your self-care routine, or if more appropriate survival technique?

Mom: Reaching out to other people and socializing. Because I have a husband and two boys at home that don’t meet my needs [Laughing] because they don’t communicate. They all have their own space. They’re very individual. They’re very alone. So then I am not able – being the social person that I am – to talk to them and just carry on conversations with them and to communicate. Because if they’ve done that all day in work or school, then they come home and they just want to come down and have down time. So I need to socialize. I need to get out of the house.

Grandmother: That’s good that you realized that.

Mom: I have, I have to do that. And I’ll realize after a few weeks, even if not getting out of the house, just being home every day taking care of the kids after school or after I get done working –  I just realize I’m very alone. That is when I have to say, “I need to go out and get with other people”.

Tammy: I can relate. What about you?

Grandmother: I have my weekly get-out group. We meet at least once a week and we road trip or we do lunch here or whatever. I have my friends. Sometimes I just take a book. Leave my phone behind. Don’t hear the door bell and just go sit on my porch and I’m in Lalaland by myself. Sometimes you just need to get away from it and find a group situation and I — I do have a good group.

Tammy: Good. So we always end this question. I think as you’ve all heard before, I think we’ve all said this a lot – “If we didn’t laugh, we’d be crying all the time” [laughing].

Mom: Ah-hmm. Which is the honest-to-God truth,  just us to get through.

Tammy: Yeah. And so we just like to open it up. Is there a laughable moment you’d like to share? Something that makes you laugh?

Mom: There are so many but a week ago, I put the beef roast in the crack pot and I had it all sitting on the counter and I had it all ready to go and then I turned it on and went to bed. And woke up the next morning and I checked the beef roast  – it was still uncooked. I thought, “Oh! My gosh, it must be broken. After all these years I must have burned it out”. Well, my husband’s like “Well, it would have helped if you would have plug it in”.

Tammy and Grandmother: [Laughing]

Mom: So we had to throw away 20 dollars-worth of beef roast because I hadn’t plugged the thing in all night long. See know I can’t even tell you what that thing is because I have such brain fog.

Tammy: Right. Would is actually something to talk about? We probably should have a whole show on this because it is hard to think clearly when you’re not getting enough sleep, when you’re having these emotional up and downs constantly, right? It’s hard to think straight.

Mom: Uh-hmm. Yep, it is.

Tammy: So I can relate to not plugging something in. That seems completely normal to me actually [laughing].

Mom: You’re like, “Oh! Shoot.”

Tammy: Yeah [laughing]. What about you, what’s your laughable moment to share?

Grandmother: Well I guess, this morning. My grandson and I went to brunch and we went to this restaurant. Our server was very nice. We had gone there previously during the week for his birthday. We got the same server today that we had for his birthday. And when he came over to set the table he said, “Good morning Bruno”.

Tammy: [Laughing]

Grandmother: Who was our server. And he looked up at him and he smiled and he said, “Good morning”. And he said, “What would you like?” And my grandson rattled off what he wanted and what I wanted. He ordered for us and then Bruno left and he said, “You know granny, he’s a nice server. He’s polite, he’s enthusiastic, he’s smiling.” And he said, “I can name seven things that are positive and why he should get a three dollars five cent tip”.

Tammy: [Laughing]

Grandmother: And I said, “Oh, okay,” and then he named most of them. He said, “No, he’s very good”. And then all of a sudden, Bruno came back and he left extra napkins. Which is something that when my husband goes out, we always ask for extra napkins whether anybody wants them or not.

Mom: It’s an OCD thing. (He really has OCD’s so it’s okay.)

Grandmother: So Bruno must have recognized us and he had the napkins and my grandson is sitting there, “Thanks again Bruno. I appreciated that”. And he said, “your food will be out right away”. And he said, “I bet it will”. So it did, it came quickly and so then we ate and it was very good. And so we left a five dollar tip for Bruno.

Tammy: [Laughing]. I just love how specific his calculation was.

[Laughing]

Grandmother: Yeah. He had seven reasons why Bruno should get it –  but I don’t know why he picked three dollars and five cents.

Tammy: [Laughing]. I just loved that.

Grandmother: He’s good at Math but I didn’t exactly get into it.

Tammy: [Laughing]. Well, thank you so much. I really appreciate you guys sharing your stories.

Grandmother: Okay.

Tammy: Thank you.

Grandmother: Thank you.

 

Speaker: You have been listening to “Just Ask Mom”, recorded and copyrighted in 2017 by Mothers on the Frontline. Today’s podcast host was Tammy Nyden. The music is “Olde English” written, performed, and recorded by FlameEmoji. For more podcasts in this and other series relating to children’s mental health, go to MothersOnTheFronline.com.

 

 

[End]

Raising her grandson after he experienced abuse, Just Ask Mom Podcast Series, episode 5

In this episode, a Grandmother tells us about raising her grandson who experienced trauma and suffered from several conditions, including ADHD, anxiety, bipolar, and learning disabilities. Please note that this story discusses child abuse and may be triggering for some of our listeners.

 

Transcription

Speaker: Welcome to the Just Ask Mom podcast where mothers share their experiences of raising children with mental illness.  Just Ask Mom is a Mothers on the Frontline production. Today we will speak with a Grandmother who is raising a grandson with mental health and learning disorders.

Tammy: Okay. Alright. So just to begin, just tell us a little bit about yourself before or outside of mothering, just about who you are.

Grandmother: Okay. I’m a mother of two boys who are grown, and um, they seem to have a fairly happy life, one has moved back to go to school, and one of them is still living on his own. After my second marriage, my husband had a son, who was a substance abuser and he abused his young son when he was very small. And we took him, in fact we took him because his father asked us to take custody of him so he could get back at his wife for doing things he didn’t like. He didn’t really think we should take him, he just thought that this legal thing would make his wife afraid to talk to anybody. And we got the papers and our lawyer talked him into guardianship, which means you can make all decisions for the child, and when he was hit and really, and really only minorly, we said, “You don’t have to go back.” And he was very happy about that, and he recently told his psychiatrist that was the happiest day of his life. He was six at that time. We have had him now, and he just recently turned eighteen, and he’s moving into this town to live in supervised housing, because he has mental illness and he has intellectual disability. And so he needs to be supervised twenty-four seven, and they offer quite a bit of other programs, things for him to do like go to a parade, or go to the park, or—really not things that cost a lot of money, although occasionally they do, but they get passes to the fair and — what not. And so this is his first day, and he’s very happy about that.

Tammy: Wonderful, wonderful. What would you like people to know about your experience?

Grandmother: I would like them to know that often, children only show the surface of what’s going, we sensed abuse but it was only later when he told us– about a month later, he told us he had been sexually abused, about a year and a half later he told us that his baby brother who had died of SIDS was actually murdered. So he was keeping this all inside. We needed to get help for him, and I really would like mothers to know that, although it just breaks your heart to take a small child to be in residential treatment, that sometimes it’s the best thing and it’s definitely not a horrible bad thing. He was kind of like, “Bye, mom” (that’s what he called me already. They said he cried a little that night, but that’s all. And he learned so much in the various times he was in the residential treatment, and the last time he was in he got into a program that was for both mentally and intellectually problematic children. And I wish there was more because, to my knowledge, it’s one of the few places that has that, and he’s in a– was in place that only took care of eight children.

Tammy: How did that help him? Like, what was positive about it?

Grandmother: One of the best things he learned was coping skills, which as a peer support specialist, I know is one of the first things you teach people who have mental illness is how are you planning on coping with this? It might just be cuddling with a soft warm blanket, it might be setting boundaries with other people that says, “I will not pull up with that.” It might be a warm bath, it might be running or doing yoga. Everybody has their own, but you teach the children that we are all unique, and they have coping skills that they can use. And they teach parents the same thing, because when you put a child into residential care – or a lot of times they don’t get to stay as long as he did –  but when you put them in, they have a goal in that time which is often 9 months to a year of learning these coping skills, which they then come home and use, and you’ve been learning them also.

Tammy: Right. So in trying to get help for your grandson, what kind of things were either barriers you ran into, or really great successes that helped you? So it sounds like one success was a residential home for him, were there any other things that either were really helpful or didn’t go so well?

Grandmother: One of the barriers was — and many mothers and fathers and even grandparents like myself, don’t know that you cannot take a child to the emergency room and say, “You can’t believe how this kid has been behaving this last month.” That does not count. A child has to have an acute problem to be admitted to the hospital which is often the best place to go, especially if they have a children’s ward for mental illness, because that way they can have their meds adjusted, which is a difficult thing to do at home. The doctor we had took him off of everything, and then slowly added things back which could be dangerous actually. So we were told- and thank God we were told- “Don’t ever go in and say: “You won’t believe how it’s been for the last month.” You have to say, “Yesterday,” –  not even ‘yesterday’- “Today, my son woke up and he is been talking about suicide.” He was only seven actually when he first did this, and he wanted us to die too, because he wanted us to go along with him, he didn’t understand death. When we said, “No, we wouldn’t do that”, and tried to explain death to him, he said, “Well then, I’ll take my cat.” We woke up in the morning and he was quite angry and I went in the back room and he was trying to strangle his cat.

Tammy: Oh, my goodness.

Grandmother: He had been acting up in other ways too. I can’t remember right now what they were but that was a clue that he was saying, “Mom, I’m so suicidal.” So I lied, I called the doctor the next day, because we were completely snowbound and had been for several days, we live in a country and our roads weren’t cleared, there was no way I could get him to the hospital, so we just watched him all day, all night, and then I called the doctor in the morning. That night he was still agitated and he had bit into a light bulb, because he wanted a weapon to fight bad guys with. He though glass would be a good idea. That was another escalation of saying, “Mom, I am really hurting, and I’m really scared, and something has to be done.” So I called the doctor and I said, “He did this and he did that”, and I made it sound like it was simultaneous, and it just happened that moment where it has actually happened the day before. Fortunately, he was young enough not to even know the truth, and so when I’m rattling off to the interviewer at the hospital, they are like, “okay” So I think that’s important for the parents to know, if you want to get help for your child other than outpatient help and which I think it’s vital if your kid has any sort of difficulty: ADHD, Tourettes– any of those things–you need to be under their care of a psychiatrist who understands the medications they are on. But if they need to be hospitalized, you need to know how to do that.

Tammy: You’re right. That’s actually a common story that I hear, and personally have been through as well. If you don’t use exact right words, right? At the exact right time.

Grandmother: You need to know the words.

Tammy:  Thank you. That’s really an important thing to hear. So we ask people as they’re dealing with this –  we understand it changes as you’re going through this, how you are doing changes throughout it –  but at this moment do you feel like you’re swimming, treading water, drowning – where do you feel like you’re at in your journey?

Grandmother: I feel like I just got out and toweled off, because my kid is, today, in a group home, where he has twenty-four hour supervision. He is not healed, but he is able to cope with most situations. He knows what to do when he’s angry, what to do when he’s frustrated. He even tells me sometimes. Maybe my husband and I have words, he’ll say, “Mom and dad, stop that! Use your coping skills.” [laughter] and he’ll guide us. Like, one day I said to my husband, the next day, because sometimes it’s best not to fight in the midst of it, I said, “You know? What you did yesterday really bothered me and I would appreciate it if you would do such and such.” And later after we had this little talk my son (my grandson had been listening) and he said, “Good job, mom.” [laughter] He’s come a long way. We got him when he was six. He’s now eighteen. He first stint in residential care was about nine months. When he was seven. It was very hard to leave him. And maybe it’s even harder for parents as opposed to grandparents, but I knew we couldn’t handle it, I knew he couldn’t handle it. We were in a mix of financial changes in the government, so how we went about it was problematic, but we had it done. We got it done and we got him in there for nine months and he came out a somewhat better person. He went back exactly a year after he had been admitted before and we realized that that time that he was probably cyclical. Some children don’t even know what day of the week it is or what day of the year it is, but his bad time was October. When the leaves fall, when the nights get darker, he had sensory things that said, “This is when I had my bad time when I was little.” So every year –  and it’s gotten much better –  he has had a bad time, actually from October till spring.

Tammy: Is that helpful at all on predicting? I mean, as you were taking care of him through all those years did that help you anticipate those months? Did it help you prepare for that more a little bit, or?

Grandmother: It did. At least we were ready for it. But every year it was less. So we’re prepared for what it was last year and the next year it’s a little bit better. Now I just recently bought, and he has never experienced it, but I bought him, one of those all-spectrum lights, which is supposed to be good for depression –that’s one of the things he suffers from. He has bipolar disorder. He experiences anxiety to a high extent sometimes, and he has just like regular depression as opposed to bipolar, and, a bunch of other [conditions]: attention deficit which is difficult, and he has difficulty learning. But every year gets better, and every year he tries harder, and so we’re looking for the worst and, bam! He’s a little worse, a little crabby, can’t sleep quite as well at night, but it’s no big deal.

Tammy: That’s great. So that’s really encouraging to hear that it can gradually get better each year.

Grandmother: Yeah, it did with him. And I think he will probably have this his whole life, bipolar is hardly ever something that goes away. But you learn what type of bipolar disorder they have and how they react as kids mature, I’ve heard of mothers especially say little girls have more of a problem, because of hormones and self-worth. Our boy got worse in early puberty, but he is such a gentleman now, it’s just—it’s wonderful.

Tammy: We like– we, parents of younger kids, really like to hear these stories. [laughter] I have to tell you. So what is your self-care routine, how do you take care of you when all this stuff that’s going on?

Grandmother: I will have to say I’m bad about that. But one of the things I remember because I also have, experienced depression and anxiety. I went to a psychiatrist and got medication. Mine is the type that I may not have to take it all my life except for one of the antidepressants helps with the pain I have it, from Fibromyalgia, which I think that many autoimmune diseases happen to mothers and grandmothers who are highly stressed. So every once-in-a-while I will make my needs known and say, “Do not wake me up in the morning.” My husband is an early riser, he likes to get up as soon as the sun is up, and sometimes he listens to me and leave me alone. [laughter] Another thing I try to do is do what I enjoy. I belong to a group that does art. I’ve never had an art class in my life. They didn’t have art when I was in school. I went to a parochial school and I won one prize in art and that’s because I picked up the wrong crayon and drew the sky dark blue. So they figured that I must have some inner angst of some sort. [laughter] But I just piddle with it. I love what I call fiber arts because it’s fun to call it an art, whereas it’s just working with thread. I like to knit. crochet, do a little quilting, and every once-in-a-while I’ll see some real arty stuff done with a little bit of yarn and a little bit of something else, and I’ve never done a piece, but I think it’d be fun.

Tammy: Yeah. That be a nice now that you have much more time on your hands, right? [laughter]

Grandmother: Yes, yes.

Tammy:  Wonderful. And, you know, the only way we get through some of this is just by laughing sometimes. What’s your most laughable moment?

Grandmother: My most laughable moments have been with my child, with my grandchild. He’s a funny kid. This one didn’t happen when I was there, but when he had his going away party there were loads of people there, even people who had already quit and gone on to grow in other areas. They said that he had been invited over to another cottage one day, because periodically they give kids a rest from their caregivers and they give their caregivers a rest from the kid, and he had a particular cottage where he liked a lot of the kids and he liked the caregiver. He went over there (and he was no longer doing it but he was aware that kids do) they kick holes in the walls. They do all kinds of stuff that—actually he never did it at home, he did horrible things at home but he never dared to kick a hole – but when he was first there, he probably did it once a week. He went over to this cottage and there was one hole on the wall, and I had hoped that maybe he’d learn a little bit of maintenance and stuff while he watched the people constantly repairing things. [laughter] So he said, “Don’t worry, I’ll fix it.” And he got some card board, and he got some crayons and he taped it all together and he wrote on the thing, “Secret tunnel.”

[laughter]

Tammy: That’s the best one I’ve heard yet. [laughter]

Grandmother: And it’s things like that make me laugh, because he’s so funny. Sometimes even his mental illness is funny, and he’ll say, “Don’t make fun of me, mom.” And I’ll say, “I’m not making fun of you, I’m laughing with you because you are a delightful child.” He’s unusual, he’s different, and we try and praise that in him, that he should be who he is. And he’s a funny kid, he’s an outgoing kid, he’s polite, and let’s not look at the fact that he has trouble learning, he’s a beautiful artist even better than I am [laughter] umand he enjoys doing things for other people.

Tammy: That’s wonderful, that’s wonderful. Well, Thank you so much for sharing your story with us, I really appreciate it.

Grandmother: Okay. Thank you.

Speaker: You have been listening to “Just Ask Mom”, recorded and copyrighted in 2017 by Mothers on the Frontline. Today’s podcast host was Tammy Nyden. The music is “Olde English” written, performed, and recorded by FlameEmoji. For more podcasts in this and other series relating to children’s mental health, go to MothersOnTheFronline.com.

[End]

Raising a son with Schizophrenia, Just Ask Mom Podcast Series, Episode 1

Anna discusses raising a son with childhood-onset schizophrenia on a Midwestern farm, the journey to the right diagnosis & medications, and what there is to celebrate.

 

Transcription:

SPEAKER: Welcome to the ‘Just Ask Mom’ podcast where mothers share their experiences of raising children with mental illness. ‘Just ask Mom’ is a Mothers on the Frontline production. Today, we will speak with Anna, the mother of a son with early onset schizophrenia.

Anna: My name is Anna and I’m from the Midwest and … oh, gosh. I went to college for computer information systems, got my degree, worked for the railroad for a number of years in information systems and married a farmer. So it’s quite a diverse life.

Tammy: Yes.

Anna:  Yeah, that’s a little bit about me.

Tammy: Very cool.

Anna: I always wanted to be a mom. Growing up, you know, I always imagined myself with five kids and when I got married to my husband, I mean, I just really imagined our life as a typical farm family, lots of kids and dogs and, you know, running around outside and life didn’t happen that way.

[music]

So we have one son, and he was actually adopted from Russia. He was 14 months old and at the time. We always expected when you adopt a child from an orphanage situation like that that there’s going be some catch up. There’s going to be some things that you need to do to play catch up. Matthew always stayed behind, though. He never was able to catch up and working through that as he got older, more and more issues came out and come to find out when he was 13 he was officially diagnosed with early onset schizophrenia. [He] had symptoms starting at the age of eight and that was a very hard thing to accept as a parent, especially when it’s your only– I mean, it’s always hard, but when it’s your only child and you’ve gone through so much to get this child and um– I went through a pretty major grieving process, you know–

Tammy: Absolutely.

Anna:  So the thing that I want other parents to know: when you’re dealing with a child with special needs and that has such a serious illness, — it’s okay. It’s okay to grieve, it’s okay to grieve for that child that you had in your heart, that you expected, that you always pictured that you would have raised. That is a loss and you shouldn’t feel guilty about grieving for that child, but then you have to move past that. You have to get to a place where you accept that child for who they are. It’s easy to say and hard to do but once you get to that place where you have truly accepted that child for who they are and for their abilities– although they may be different than what you expected, you– you’ll find that things are easier. You’ll find that it’s not as hard to accept where they’re at and enjoy them for who they are and every day becomes easier.

Tammy: This is especially a lesson you have to learn in this particular situation but what you’re saying is true for any parent.

Anna: Sure. Absolutely. For any parent, any child. You can have a child that is neuro-typical but they don’t have the same likes as you do and they don’t have the same interests as you do and you guys are polar opposites and you still have to accept that child for who they are. You may butt heads but you have to realize they are their own individual. Absolutely.  I think for my husband, I’ll kind of speak to that little bit– he’s a farmer. He’s a typical Midwestern farmer and grew up in a very sheltered environment, you know, didn’t ever really have any exposure to the big city and diversity and things like that, and it was, I mean, he had it in his mind his expectations of his child would be that they would help him farm. They would grow up learning that and doing that and that wasn’t something that Matthew could do. That was really hard for him to accept and as long as he wasn’t accepting that, as long as he was fighting that internally, he was miserable. Once he was able to accept that, he could move on with his life and he could be happy and enjoy his son again. And so it’s not just for the child, it’s for us.

Tammy: Absolutely.

Anna: You know, and I’m not saying that everything’s roses once you accept that -once you learn. Some people accept that easier than others and it’s not all peachy keen after that. You still have to fight for your child. I mean, I got involved with Mental Health Advocacy here in our State because there is so much lacking and there is so much that needs to be done yet. It’s not fair. We should not have to become mama bears at the school and fight so hard for what is rightfully deserving of them. And it is still an issue but it doesn’t become all consuming, I guess, once you can accept that I think it frees you up a little bit to stop obsessing about what they can’t do and focus on what they can and then that helps you when forming that IEP [Individualized Education Plan] and when talking to the doctors and trying to find a medication that works, then you’re not as miserable doing all of that I guess.

Tammy: Absolutely. One thing you and I talked about and I was wondering if you’d share here is (and this fits into what you’re talking about with expectations) is how your parenting changes because what your child needs is not the traditional method of parenting.

Anna: Right.  Absolutely. Again, my husband is a farmer and he grew up, and myself too, I grew up in the Midwest. I was raised when I was young on a farm and then we lived in a small town and we were both very much raised by ‘pull yourself up by your bootstraps’ –  I mean with very common sense parenting and spanking was not unheard of. That was just how we were raised and that’s the example we had as parents and so when he was young and things would happen, I mean, we didn’t spank. That wasn’t really what we wanted to do, but we would use sticker charts, we would use timeout, we would use all the things that you could think of, grounding and taking rewards and punishments. We tried everything and nothing ever seemed to work. It was so very frustrating and you would get so angry and frustrated and then you find yourself raising your voice and you’re yelling and it’s constant and nothing ever works and you’re just pulling your hair out.  Once we finally accepted his diagnosis and learned we simply can’t expect the same things. We cannot put as many demands on them. That’s part of that acceptance process that I was talking about as a parent – accepting your child for who they are and what they can do and once you realize that, then naturally your expectations change and so your parenting style does change.

Tammy: Thank you for that. That’s right. So, we ask everyone this. We know it changes from moment to moment. At this exact moment, do you feel like you’re swimming, treading water, sinking? Where do you feel like you’re at?

Anna: I feel like we’re swimming.

Tammy: Wonderful.

Anna: I feel like we are– it just makes me want to cry. I think [laugh] because we have come so far. I mean we came from a place where, I would say five years ago I was not sure I was ever going be able to have my son in my house again. He was violent and we had to place him in the PMIC [Pediatric Mental Institution for Children] and we just didn’t know where to go. We had no idea where to turn for help. We could not control him any longer. I just couldn’t imagine him ever coming back home, ever graduating from high school, ever having a life that was meaningful to him. Let alone something that we could call successful. Today he is getting ready to graduate from high school, he has been back home with us for almost five years and he’s getting ready to graduate high school, he’s going to prom.

Tammy: This is so wonderful.

Anna: He is just– he is excelling in so many ways and I could have never imagined that. So, I mean, we’re in love with life right now.

Tammy: A lot of hard work went into that.

Anna: A lot of hard work went into that. It was a combination of the doctors and finding the right medication, getting the right diagnosis first of all and then finding the right medications, and then finding the right school. We ended up finding this awesome therapeutic school that he went to for about three years and they were just phenomenal. So finding the right school environment and changing our parenting style and having the right support at home. We had a waiver from the State that allowed some in-home assistance, you know, with therapy and things like that and all of those things created this beautiful movement towards putting him on the path to success

Tammy: And now he’s a contributing member of society.

Anna: Absolutely.

Tammy: He’s working.

Anna: He has a job lined up for after he graduates. He’s planning on having his own apartment. I have every reason to believe that he will be successful. Five years ago I couldn’t have imagined that.

Tammy: Right. So, all of those services made all that difference.

Anna: Everything made all the difference. It was not just one thing that I could point to, without one thing, without the others would not have had made much of an impact. I don’t believe.We had to change every aspect of his life to help set him up for success and help him learn about his illness and help him accept his illness because that’s a whole process too.

Anna: And he knows, I mean, I have probably the biggest reason that I feel like he will be successful is because he knows he has an illness. He accepts he has an illness. He knows the medication helps him and he is absolutely adamant about taking that medication because he knows that helps him. So many times with schizophrenia people start to believe that the medication is making them sick –I’m not saying that that might not happen in the future. This is just where we’re at today, but he knows [the medication] helps him and he wants to take it and if that continues that is what will help him be successful and help him work.

Tammy: I just want to sort of have you bring out one other piece because I think this is so important for parents that are in the middle of the journey, like where you were five years ago. You had mentioned he was eight when he started having symptoms but he got his diagnosis of early onset schizophrenia at 14.

Anna: At 13.

Tammy: Oh, at 13. So, there were many years of changing diagnoses and not knowing.

Anna:  For five years, it went from PDD NOS to, well,  first, it started out at age six, that was ADHD, and then at age eight it was Tourette Syndrome and PDD NOS, which is Pervasive Development Disorder [Not Otherwise Specified], and he was having hallucinations at that time and the psychiatrist told us then that some people that are diagnosed with PDD NOS go on to officially be diagnosed with schizophrenia. So, it was thrown out at that time but he was way too young to have that diagnosis. It was just going to be time would tell and then it went on. We went on to add generalized anxiety disorder and OCD and then bipolar mood disorder and all of these diagnosis brought on other medications. And every medication specifically to treat the mood disorder or to treat the anxiety or to treat the ADHD– they all did different things to his system. We just never knew what was doing what, and so it was really hard to suss out what was him or was the medication. And so it was a constant changing of medication and trying to find a combination that worked and this whole time he’s getting worse. He is getting sicker and no one was really addressing the psychosis, which was really the elephant in the room. He was so bad by the time he went into residential that he was completely incontinent both urinary and bowel. He couldn’t get through an hour without a meltdown of some sort and getting angry. He wasn’t sleeping at night at all.He would be up all night. There were times before he went into residential, we were taking turns sleeping in his room. He had trundle bed in his room. We would shut his door, push the trundle bed back up against the door and sleep in his room with him. He wouldn’t sleep but at least we knew he was safe, Then we could sleep. Before that he was up all night and he was doing things that were not appropriate like taking apart light sockets, painting the wall, taking apart his closet doors and at one point he got a hold of some candles and matches and was playing with those, burning spot on the floor. Luckily he didn’t catch the whole house on fire but, he was hiding knives in his room. There were a lot of things he was doing that were dangerous – so that was one piece of it but then he was trying to put his head through windows. [There was a lot of self-harm and there was a lot of hospitalizations in there too. He was having a lot of hallucinations –  seeing knives coming out of the walls and Mario was chasing him around the house with the battle ax. When we first realized he was having hallucinations, I’ll never forget.  He came up to me, he was eight years old and he came up to me and he was crying and he said, mommy, I don’t want to kill myself, and I said, well ,what do you mean you don’t– of course, you don’t want to kill yourself. Well, I don’t want to stab myself but they keep telling me to stab myself and I’m like who? – trying to figure out who they are. Is it somebody at school bullying him? This was on a Saturday I think and so I– no, a Friday –  kept him home from school, called the psychiatrist. Long story short, we ended up going in to the hospital to be evaluated. They didn’t– because he was so young– and he didn’t really have a plan. He didn’t want to die. So they didn’t admit him but that was our first realization. Then in the ER, when they were talking to him, they were asking him, does he ever see odd things and he’s talking about these people he sees hanging from nooses, [it was] very gory. I was just completely shocked. Not long after that we were in the grocery store and he just looked at me with this forlorn long look on his face and he said, mommy, why– why does God make me see all these people that aren’t here, which was really interesting when he said that they aren’t here.

Tammy: He knew?

Anna: He knew they weren’t real and I said what do you mean, do you see them right now? We were in the grocery store in an aisle with no other customers and I said do you see them right now and he said, yeah, and I said, well, how many people do you see and he just sighed rather heavily and he said too many to count. It freaked me out in the beginning–

Tammy: Yeah, of course.

Anna: Of course. I wasn’t ready to accept the diagnosis of schizophrenia even at the age 13, even after five years of going through all those changes and all those med changes and all those different diagnoses. I kept thinking it’s not possible for one child to have so many things wrong with them. It’s not possible for one child to have all these different diagnoses and you know and then they added schizophrenia on top of this I just I couldn’t believe it. There had to be another explanation. So we went to doctors all over, we went to Mayo Clinic, we saw a lot of specialists, thinking well, maybe it’s something genetic, maybe there’s another explanation – another diagnosis that encompasses all of these and to no avail. Nothing else was ever found. I really think– I believe and I don’t know if the doctors would agree but I believe that schizophrenia is the main diagnosis. Schizophrenia is his diagnosis. It’s just that when you’re six and you have developing schizophrenia  – and I should say schizophrenia and mood disorder combined. He definitely has a mood disorder, but when you have these things and you’re six, it looks like ADHD. And then when you’re eight, because the movements and things go along with the schizophrenia – it still is technically, clinically Tourette syndrome but um–

Tammy: But that’s pretty generally defined, right? Like, over a year you have a vocal and a motor tic.

Anna: Absolutely. But if you look at people with schizophrenia a lot of them do have movement disorders. And so does he fit the diagnosis in all these? Absolutely, if you look at it from a clinical standpoint. But you have to look at the bigger picture and say guess what. He has schizophrenia and because he has schizophrenia it causes him to have a lot of anxiety. I mean, schizophrenia is like granddaddy of anxiety disorders! So, of course, it’s going looks like he has generalized anxiety disorder and OCD and he is going be inattentive. So it’s kind of looks like he has ADHD because he can’t focus on anything because all he has is this internal stimulation. And he’s going to have movement disorders because that’s just part of what goes along with it and so, does he have all these diagnoses? No. He has schizophrenia.

Tammy: But that was a really long journey to get to it.

Anna: Absolutely.

Tammy:  I’m really glad that you’re sharing this because there are so many moms who might be hearing this, who are in the middle of it and it just seems like they’re never going to get to a point where things are okay. And you share that they can.

Anna: You can. Absolutely you can. You will get there and it won’t seem like it at the time. Some days it will absolutely tear you apart, but keep pushing, keep persevering, keep being an advocate for your child. Be that mama bear that you need to be and you’ll get there. You know I told my husband we’re going to have this graduation party for my son and I said you know, I’m pulling out all the stops for this graduation party. I said because this is just as much my retirement party as his graduation party because I’ve made a complete career out of his education and getting him to where he is now. Now I can kind of sit back — not that my job’s completely over –but I can relax a little bit and let him kind of begin his life and I feel confident that he can do that right now.

Tammy: Okay, this is about as heavy as life can get, right? So, we ask everyone the same last question. What’s your most laughable moment and I’m sure there have been many but what comes to mind as something that makes you smile through all this?

Anna: Oh gosh. I don’t know if I have that one laughable moment. I know there’s a lot of moments I look back on and think, God, why the heck did I do that? and kind of beat myself up over it. I think back and  it’s kind of funny now– but it’s not really but I don’t know maybe you guys can relate. So, this one time Matthew was five, I want to say and looking back now I know he has some developing psychosis but of course at that time I had no clue.

Tammy: Five year old’s have big imaginations so it’s not easy to know.

Anna: Absolutely, and like I said, we did not like to spank Matthew.

Anna: I mean, I was at my wits end. Nothing was working as far as punishments and rewards and timeouts and I mean I put him in time out and he would just laugh at me. So I decided  I just had enough and we went to the mall. I had to go in real quick. He didn’t handle the stores very well at all at that time but I had to go in there and pick up one item for a baby shower, something real quick, and I told him,“ if you can just bear with me and we’re going run in here,  I’m going get one thing and we’re going to go back out and then we’ll go to McDonald’s.” You know, his favorite place to eat and we will get some chicken nuggets and you know, I said, “just please,” you know, I’m begging with him. I’m bartering with him at the time, and of course, we go in the mall and he starts. He is just being an obstinate little kid hollering about, “I wanna go, I wanna leave”. Looking back I think he was fearful. Yeah. I think he was afraid.

Tammy: I see.

Anna:  And I think he was probably seeing things and hearing things that I didn’t know anything about.

Anna: He just kept hollering at the top of his lungs how he wanted to leave wanted to go. I told him, I said, “Matthew if you don’t stop right now then I’m going to spank you.” He just looked at me. I’m telling myself, it’s come to this. I have to do this. He kept on, he kept on. I said, okay, every time that you holler out that’s one more spanking. So we never did make it to the store. I ended up turning around and going back to the car and no McDonald’s. We were going home and we lived about 30 minutes from this mall. So, all the way home he is laughing at me and giving me this shitty little grin. He says, “your spankings don’t hurt. You can’t hurt me!”, you know just being this little shit. And so I kept adding one to it every time he would back talk me. I would add one to it, by the time I got home I was up to like 36 you know, and I had to follow through.

Anna: I had to spank him 36 times.

Anna: And it was horrible but I did it and it didn’t help. You know, he laughed, he– and it was that manic crazy laugh the whole time through it and looking back now I know that he was dealing with psychosis. I had no clue what psychosis was. I had no clue what mental illness was at that time.
And, you know, that’s another thing through this whole process – I have learned so much about mental illness. I used to be one of those that I looked at homeless people and thought, “if I can get a job, if I can pull myself up by my bootstraps then you can too.”  I didn’t understand what severe mental illness was. I really didn’t and I didn’t have a lot of compassion for those people. I feel like that’s part of why God put Matt in my life because he wanted me to learn that lesson. He wanted me to understand and have more compassion. Not that that moment at the mall was funny but looking back, you know, I mean we have to kind of laugh at ourselves and at the judgement calls we make and not beat ourselves up about it too much because we’re going to make those mistakes. We don’t know. It’s a learning process.

Tammy: Absolutely.

Anna: And we have to continue learning.

Tammy: Absolutely. Well, thank you so much. I really appreciate this. I know many people will benefit from your story.

Anna: Thank you.

Speaker: You have been listening to ‘Just Ask Mom’ recorded and copyrighted in March 2017 by Mother’s on the Frontline. Today’s Podcast host is Tammy Nyden. The music is “Olde English”, written, performed and recorded by Flame Emoji. For more podcasts on this and other series relating to Children’s Mental Health, go to Mothers on the Frontline.com.